By now everyone will be aware that AG Barr stated today that he "doesn't expect" that the involvement of Obama and Biden in the Russia Hoax "will lead to a criminal investigation over either man. Our potential on criminality is focused on others."
That's a kind of good new - bad news statement. The good news is for Obama and Biden. The bad news has to do with those "others" on whom Durham is focused, because I assume that that this increases Durham's determination to take his investigation as high up the chain of command in the Obama administration as possible.
Strictly speaking, Barr's words could be parsed in a number of ways, and contradictions founds.
One standard for every American? Except ex POTUS and VPOTUS? How does that work?
On the other hand, "doesn't expect ..."? Is Barr open to surprises?
Rather than nitpick, however, I think we understand where he's coming from--he, unlike Dems, is actually concerned for the country. He wants--again, unlike Dems--to point the way to depoliticizing justice in America. It's a laudable goal and worth striving for--no matter how unrealistic it is. Here is Undercover Huber's summary:
AG Barr today
—Collusion hoax used against Trump was “baseless” and “unprecedented in American history”
—Durham is a criminal investigation
—Does not believe - based on his knowledge of Durham probe - that Obama or Biden will personally be the focus of a criminal investigation
—Durham’s focus “is on others” involved
—DOJ under Obama had “dual standard” - rules for Trump, and rules for everybody else
—DOJ must have *one* standard for *every* American
—DOJ will only prosecute if it can prove every element of a crime “beyond a reasonable doubt”
—Not every “abuse of power”, no matter how egregious, is necessarily a federal crime that can be prosecuted
—But Durham is trying to “get to the bottom of what happened”, and if crimes can be proven, will bring perpetrators to justice
And here's a "rough transcript of Barr's words:
Excellent. I do like the principle of one standard of justice for everyone.ReplyDelete
Barr is realistic. To say Obama is in his sights would bring a torrent of bad press. Better to go after Brennan and Clapper who IMHO will be more than willing to throw the former POTUS under the bus !ReplyDelete
It's true that Obama probably didn't hold a gun to anyone's head to make them do the things they did. They were all adults and made their choice.Delete
"Better to go after Brennan and Clapper...."Delete
Even if they don't throw the former POTUS under the bus.
Many realistic Righties won't mind Barr ducking pursuit of Sparklefarts, as long as enough of his minions fry, so that liberals noses are rubbed into the huge magnitude of Sparklefarts' crowd's criminality.
Know who is all of a sudden missing in action, especially with dem governors acting like fascists. ANTIFA!!! wonder what happened to those guys.Delete
Why predict the outcome of ongoing investigations?ReplyDelete
That's what Obama did when he said Mrs Clinton meant well.
That's what Comey did when he exonerated Mrs Clinton.
Why not just do what he said he was going to do: Let Durham investigate and then use appropriate prosecutorial discretion to charge where there is evidence of criminal conduct.
If I were a federal prosecutor I would certainly take into account all of the considerations which arise in questioning the actions of a President or Vice President while in office.
But I wouldn't predict my conclusions before the investigation is complete.
I understand what he wants to do, but IMO it's not realistic so he should just apply one standard like he says he wants to, and let the chips fall where they may. OTOH, this may be a bit of push back against Trump's recent public remarks which probably went too far.Delete
“Depoliticizing justice”? You mean if Barr smacks all involved on the back of the hand they’ll go home & never do it again?ReplyDelete
SERIOUSLY? This is a frigging attempted coup in broad daylight instituted - allegedly- by an outgoing POTUS with full knowledge of VPOTUS!
If there aren’t serious repercussions for all involved - & no one gets to skate BC of the “approved” color of their skin - IT. WILL. HAPPEN. AGAIN.
There is no justice in this country anymore: you’re a salon owner under Gauleiter lockdown & you open up - off to the clink for you!!
If you’re a former POTUS/VPOTUS/FBI head/CIA head go ahead & institute a coup/attempted frame up of your political enemy & you get a PASS.
This is tantamount to playing with Nitroglycerin.
Backing off from the evidence will guarantee that it does happen again. However, there are other steps that can be taken short of indictment, if warranted. Barr has not ruled out a separate report.Delete
While still loading your gun, best not to announce everything youre going to do with it.Delete
A couple of points:Delete
1. Obama likely has plausible deniability. Biden more so. If Durham goes for the likes of Comey Clapper and Brennan, he's going to have to square that circle, re how much did Obama know.
2. If prosecution against other big fish succeeds, they may be willing to testify against Obama, if he was indeed guilty.
3. Obama can be impeached. Barr said abuse of power does not necessarily equal an illegal act. Such impeachment may satisfy our lust for justice/revenge.
4. Ultimately, it would be a mistake to go after Obama at this point in time. The Overton window has not shifted that far yet - most non politically aware Americans may feel it is purely politically motivated. It would motivate the Dem base.
Good points. Susan Rice's "by the book" email to self is part of the mix for #1. It's hard to get to 'beyond a reasonable doubt' if he says: Hey, I told them to operate according to the book.Delete
Mr Wauk -ReplyDelete
This is how you get vigilante justice.
If the *only* major moves are, "other steps that can be taken, short of indictment", a huge slice of "red" America won't wait for the next coup/attempted frame up.ReplyDelete
Instead, they'll face the music, that the next attempted frame up will finish the job started in the first such bid, and that their outright survival hinges on them seceeding, or some such.
Don't forget that this is all politics, in the Big Sense of the word. To expect it to play out in a nice orderly way isn't realistic. The major factor that we have on our side is Trump. As long as Barr and Durham do an honest job, Trump will know how to play it.Delete
I have never believed Obama would ever be charged with anything.ReplyDelete
I have contributed that on other threads to bias due to his skin, but that statement is more about my own cynicism on US race relations today.
Mark made a comment a while back about the fact that, in essence, recalling from imperfect memory, that no one wants to be the first to criminally charge a former US President. I think it was also mentioned that if the roles were politically reversed, it would happen or something like that.
Obama is just golden. Some people are like that. Some recognize it, use whatever advantages and levers they have, and go on to powerful positions in which they squander or use for overall good.
What’s ironic about this specific topic is that President Lincoln to this day is vilified by some for saving the United States. Even more ironic, and actually relevant to today, is what the Republicans did to Lincoln’s Vice President. Yet, Lincoln’s VP, Democrat Andrew Johnson survived, barely.
In my view, if it is found concretely that Obama and/or Biden was integral in this entire mess of violating the civil rights of Americans, then they should be fully prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law and that includes being passively aware and allowing it to occur.
Regarding people fed up with the federal government and it’s approach to policing it’s own, including US Presidents.ReplyDelete
I offer the Oklahoma bombing by McVeigh. It was a direct response to Ruby Ridge and Waco by a lower member of the US military who fully internalized his oath.
I offer the Cliven Bundy standoff due to the US Bureau of Land Management.
I offer all the civil and uncivil protests that are occurring right now all across America to due the lockdown.
This may be the spark that ignites the dry tinder.
Yes, the vast majority of Americans are not Ivey League trained, but, as a whole, they are not stupid, and will fight back when pushed.
They, we, are being pushed in a myriad of ways and on many different levels.
This statement by AG Barr was unwise.
Barr: "I don't expect Mr. Durham's work will lead to an investigation of either man."ReplyDelete
Notice what Barr did there.... he could have simply said: "DOJ's work on the handling of the Russia Collusion Hoax ...." instead of "Mr. Durham's work."
But he didn't do that. The literal interpretation of that wording is Durham's work is not expected to lead to anything regarding Biden or Obama, but that does not rule out OTHER prosecutors who are investigation things independent of Durham.
More specifically, Biden should be sweating bullets over the US Attorney Barr appointed to review Giuliani's Ukraine information. That's where Biden likely has the greatest exposure (money laundering/kick-back deals.)
Ever since Barr appointed Jensen and other US Attorneys to look into various matters, I have suspected the real purpose was to set up multiple parallel criminal investigations, offloading peripheral matters to the other US Attorneys, freeing up Durham to concentrate on the more important conspiracy charges, and allowing multiple criminal prosecutions to proceed simultaneously, if the evidence is there. The Deep State will not know what hit them.
My take on this:ReplyDelete
- Barr’s comments ease some of the politicization optics, I.e. we won’t touch your messiah or mess with the election (Biden).
- This allows acting with a Writ of Mandamus or other method to end the Flynn fiasco. The left will still attack, but DOJ can fall back on the first point.
- Then, full steam ahead with prosecuting the rest of the conspirators.
I think there will definitely be prosecutions. Baker flipping was huge I believe.
And those that oversaw or directed it are “getting off scott free”Delete
I believe he expressed his opinion of what he expected. And he expressed it that way, as his opinion. As of now. He didn’t say “there won’t be…” But we know how everyone hangs on the letter of every word he utters. Then they put their own skeptical spins on. I don’t believe this necessarily means the absolute “never happen” that everyone is running to… We don’t know what Durham will have developed by the time he gets all the worker bees in the coup set for indictment. What they will be have said about who did what…ReplyDelete
I agree with Dov, its time to hate what they have done to us and our president.ReplyDelete
Oof! Powerful stuff. He's write. But I think getting that message across, yet still communicating love for all America, is what Trump is good at. That's not Barr's job. I do worry about him sounding to conciliatory at times, but I also believe that his actions will speak louder in the final analysis.Delete
I see truth in what everyone is saying, to one degree or another. Everyone knows I'm a Barr fan, at least for the current crisis. However, one problem I see with what Barr is saying is that a significant part of the country knows that the weaponizing of our government institutions for the purpose of 1) suppressing opposition and 2) fundamentally transforming the country in ways that were never debated and voted on goes back to 2008. Addressing the Russia Hoax is necessary, but there was permanent damage done to the country in multiple ways and that will, seemingly go unaddressed.ReplyDelete
Of course I'm not suggesting that one man can address all of this in a couple of years. I'm sure Barr spoke today, quite briefly, with a specific purpose in mind--a purpose that is tied to the near future. We also know from his major addresses--such as to the Federalist Society--that he has a pretty sound grasp of the larger politico-societal-cultural issues we face as a nation. My concern is that his remarks today may strike a wrong note with many, making him appear a bit out of touch--which I don't think he actually is.
Fortunately, this isn't a one time thing. Nor is he running for office and needing to watch the polls. He can make up for any misperceptions going forward.
Imagine being in Barr's place - a "leader" of an organization infested with Democrat partisans who will not be "led". He made it clear the 2016/2017 DoJ was corrupt. I really can't ask him to say more than that at this point (in public).Delete
Every time Trump goes on the air and says "we got em", the Deep State goes into apoplexy. When he first did this last December, Pelosi unleashed the hounds of impeachment. Now a renegade judge is elevating the persecution of poor Mike Flynn into a Constitutional crisis.ReplyDelete
This escalation will not end until Durham unseals his indictments and the Deep State gets a taste of it's own medicine. But he is not yet ready to do so, so that leaves Bill Barr no choice but to run interference in the media. It's just a smokescreen.
And no, Obama will not be indicted over Spygate or RussiaGate. But he damn sure may be indicted for other far more serious crimes. What's still hiding in the closet will shock the nation to it's core.
Or, if Durham is going after the Made Men, whose orders SparkleFarts was following?ReplyDelete
Soros, Bezos, Zuckerberg, Gates...?
SparkleFarts likely won't run again anyway.
It's far more crucial, to break the cabal that enthroned him.
That would shock the world to it's core.
I'm not suggesting Barr is factoring this in, but politically, I like it. I very much believe Trump has earned and can garner a not-insignificant share of the vote of Black America, and few things would have thrown that chance out the window like appearing to go hard now after Obama-Biden.ReplyDelete
Anyone out there who thinks he's closed any doors here is totally misreading this. He and Durham, et al are working their way up the chain, and if enough wrongdoing can eventually be shown to have happened below Obama, then probably enough voters will demand to know what Obama knew and when he knew it, so to speak, that a reelected Trump can help those people find out, should he choose to do so (spoiler alert: he'll choose to do so).
Anything can happen then, but all that *needs* to happen is for something close to the whole truth to come out. For a person in Obama's position, that is an incredibly stiff penalty. (The Brennans, Comey's, etc need a whole different sort of punishment, obviously.)
So this move seems to me to make perfect sense. It gives him a much better chance of getting at least some small semblance of cooperation from parts of the public, the establishment, and witnesses that he never could have gotten if the story line were that he's going after Obama and Biden - which is precisely the story line the Resistance was sure to pin on him sooner, not later.
Right on. As a reader at CTH has put it, "Prosecuting Obama is the ideal way, to get his worshippers to the polls to vote for Biden."Delete
As it stands now, black Dem turnout figures to be, at best, what it was in '16.
And, seeing how much the economy in Det., and other quite black cities, was spurred since DJT took office, and seeing how brazen the Left's race baiting has been since then, DJT's %% of the black vote may shock the MSM.
The Dems can't imagine, that blacks are smart enough
to see thru the Left's hyper-crass stoking of racial paranoia, e.g. that the GOP would bring back Jim Crow.
I'll just say, that I know blacks, who are far smarter that the Dems presume.
This is particularly true of religious blacks.
Speaking of CTH - and their whining for Senate investigations - any Senate "investigation" would be a de-facto political exercise. I thought the idea was to de-politicize the DoJ, not to further politicize it. Every time Lindsey Graham says he's NOT going to interfere while Durham is working, I'm amazed at how sober he sounds. It's like Barr has given him the same lecture he's given Trump.Delete
Right. There's no likelihood that any witness will cooperate, now that Durham is active.Delete
My Mother commented she was glad that Obama was fighting back against Trump with that “leaked” call, finally.ReplyDelete
I agree with Barr, going after Obama using the criminal justice system would be seen as political, and to Mark’s point bad politics. And as another comment noted, potentially make him into a martyr, and super charge turnout for Biden.
I have mixed feelings on Obama / Biden being charged. I believe in 1 standard of justice in the USA., I have a lot of anger on how treasury (irs), Intel agencies, osha, fbi, doj, etc were weaponized against Obama opponents, but it’s more important for Trump to get a 2nd term, and expose the mid-deeds.
And Trump is doing an amazing job of showing the reach, bias, and incompetence of the clarify.
"incompetence of the clarify."Delete
Do you mean, the clerisy?
Yes - clerisy.Delete
AG Barr is doing the Lord’s work. I just think this was an unforced error. Heck, Trump does this a lot and I really like Trump in every way.ReplyDelete
Problem is the Democrat controlled House thinks it is still investigating the previous submitted impeachment charges or has started another impeachment investigation ...
It will never cease. Not even after they gain full power. Things have changed and it happened long ago.
In my view it was with the impeachment of Clinton. He truly committed several felonies. Granted, considering the Constitution, the Federalist Papers, and other writings of the time when we adopted our Constitution, Clinton should have never been compelled to testify in any civil or criminal case against him while he was President. However, he did and lied, committing perjury and suborned perjury with two other people.
Those are felonies that would have anyone else in prison.
Then W. They tried to hang him on the stupid Florida chad. Recount after recount till finally the courts said enough. Prior, they tried to fake an Air National Guard memo/eval/whatever that internet folks quickly debunked (Little Green Footballs, Allahpundit, etc)
Here we are. W finalized the destruction of the Constitution with the Patriot Act because a rich Muslim Saudi went all Saladin and believed, in many ways correctly, the US was a sham (USS Cole for example). Obama was just the recipient of post-Constitutional powers and made haste in using them.
We gotta play for keeps. Even Lincoln understood this.
Yeah, Clinton should have never been compelled to testify. Why didn't he fight like hell vs. that, all the way to the Supremes?Delete
"W finalized the destruction of the Constitution".
Bork saw this, but others wouldn't.
Thanx for nuthin', Conservatism Inc.
Save Obama/Biden for after the election. If Biden wins, he can always be impeached :)ReplyDelete
For a Commander-in-Chief of the military who supported ISIS, Iran, Cuba and China, it seems the proper forum may be a military tribunal for Obama and Biden?ReplyDelete